Random observation inspired by outlining

It is really weird to be able to see exactly how and why, pedagogically speaking, your professor is organizing class - because you, too, used to do this - and yet at the same time, come up with the total typical student "this is the first time I've thought about this issue" answer.

It's not so much that I think I should come up with a better student answer than any of the other students - I don't. It's more that on some level, I don't think I should be coming up with student answers at all. Because I still kind of identify with the front of the room, not the back. So when I come up with student answers, sometimes I feel kind of stupid - even though if I were a prof whose student came up with the same answer, I'd never in the world think they were stupid.

And I'm sure that my profs don't actually think I'm stupid. They just think I'm a student. Because I that's what I am.

It's just that sometimes I wish I could get past this student stage more quickly, since, life-wise, I feel behind already!

Hmmm, being behind seems to be the theme of the day.

Shorter version of this and my previous post: being a student is infantilizing.

No need to thank me for that staggering insight.

Comments

[dance]

Well, I've noticed that professors act exactly like students in "classroom" situations, regardless. Eg, a work-in-progress talk when a prof tried to lead discussion of some key sources. No one wanted to talk. Similar behavior in teaching workshops.

[Another Damned Medievalist]

but even at conferences, don't you find that we are always walking the line between 'expert' and 'student'?

dance - that is very true! I've *been* those profs. But in those cases, it's just that profs don't want to come up with answers, partly because they *do* see themselves as peers of the people trying to get them to talk, in a way that students and profs aren't in a real classroom (no one is grading the profs at teaching workshops).

ADM - yeah, but I think it's different. If you go to a conference as a prof, you're at a gathering of peers - some may be higher in rank than you, but profs are all still in the same general category. There are hierarchies within that category, sure, but it's still one category. Whereas student-hood is a different category. As a medievalist, even if I went to a conference session on something about which I know nothing (say, 8th-century Byzantium), I'm there in the position of a learner, but not a student. If that makes sense.

[New Kid on the Hallway]

Oops, that last comment was me!

[Rachel]

I teach a lot of "non-traditional" students, meaning that many of my students are older than 22. Any ideas on how to make the student role less infantilizing? For many of my students, I think they're very sensitive to feeling "behind" so they also feel alienated. To make it even more extreme, I teach a language, which further infantilizes the learner.

[kellyinkansas]

I would appreciate some clarification on how you delineate learner from student. I looked at finishing my PhD as the point at which I could decide what I wanted to learn next instead of being told - although there is plenty of guidance out there for direction if the need arises.

Also, I have a low tolerance point for colleagues who have decided to quite learning because they are already experts on everything they need to be - even if it's microscopic and, as we all know, knowledge is every-evolving - if not in content, in the way we approach the content.

I admire your being able to go back into the formal classroom setting, BTW.

[New Kid on the Hallway]

Rachel - you know, I can't come up with anything except things I'm sure you've already thought of. (I.e., don't assume your students are all living in the dorm, facing being on their own for the first time, etc. - I have one prof who tends a little too much in this direction, although overall I like hir fine.) It's kind of hard because I know sometimes non-traditional students want to use their life experience to trump the professor's knowledge (though I suspect that doesn't happen so much with a language!), so it's a fine line between acknowledging a student's former life, and encouraging the students who want to trade on it. It's funny, thinking about it, my language textbooks in the past have all seemed to be written with 18-year-olds in mind, which might be a bit odd for the non-trads (I don't know what level you teach/what materials you use). It's a good question, though!