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    « I am so effing proud of myself | Main | Just about had a heart attack »

    Friday, August 29, 2008

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    I noticed that she researched about the issues and exercised a choice to carry on with the pregnancy: a choice which her political stance would deny to others. Typical.

    When I was pregnant with youngest, we did an amnio to screen for abnormalities (the risk factors came back relatively low) but we ended up with a special needs child in any case. When do I get my anti-abortion halo to wear with my "Pro-Choice Mom" t-shirt?

    I think that Michael Berubé's written most eloquently about disability studies and parenting of special needs children. Given his own parenting experience with one son with Down's syndrome, I would hold him up as an excellent spokesperson for the issue!

    I'm pro-life but I think you're dead on here.

    If she'd chosen to carry a child to term when it was certain giving birth would take her own life, I might be impressed. That would be a sacrifice. Of course, then she'd be dead.

    also, can I just take a minute and call for a moratorium on the graphic photos? Yeck. Like I said, I'm pro-life but the graphic images and the explaining the mechanics of human development to women who are considering abortion and the standing outside of clinics yelling at people? Just...no. Really.

    i have to say that i agree with you 100%. about everything, across the board (not to sound like a sycophant), but yeah, like the vast amount of women who have abortions do so because their babies aren't perfect or they can't be bothered. geez louise! i just have one word for those of mccain's and pallin's ilk--cukoo!!

    This is a fantastic post -- it really hits the important points and makes them clear.

    Totally agree with you on all this.

    And FWIW (not much), we had tests (though not an amnio) to check for DS and other things before Waylon was born. I am adamantly pro-choice, but we wouldn't have terminated even if those had come up positive. Just throwing that out there.

    I am strongly pro-life and the mother of a daughter with Down syndrome. I think you bring up some good points. I read an article which called Palin's decision to "keep" the baby after an in-utero diagnosis of Down syndrome "heroic" . Those were the writer's words, not Governor Palin's. I don't think she would define that as an heroic act-just a human act. By the way, most studies say that at least 90% of women who receive a Down syndrome diagnosis in-utero do choose to abort. I would have to assume that the majority of those women are pro-choice because it would go against all reason for a pro-lifer to abort. By the very fact that they choose to abort, they are defined as pro-choice, no? This is not to say that all pro-choice women would "leap" to abort. I am friends with many pro-choice women who either decided to continue with their pregnancy after a DS diagnosis or who only found out after the birth. I am also friends with many pro-life women who have children with DS-the majority of whom refused all prenatal testing and a few who did receive an in-utero diagnosis. And since most people do not step forward to tell me if they aborted a child with DS, I have truly no idea how many would be pro-life or pro-choice.

    In lighter news, The Wall Street Journal already has an article about her fitness and diet routines:
    [http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122002155637283431.html?mod=yhoofront]


    Don't recall seeing any of these for JB.

    Sorry the link didn't come through. The title of the article is "Gov. Sarah Palin: Midnight runs and caribou dinners" and it is written by Jen Murphy.

    I agree with your points, and I also found myself wondering: how did it happen that this decision got into the media? Did she share the results of her prenatal test with the media, and if so, why?

    I also wonder who's going to be caring for this baby while she travels the country during the campaign, and the world as vice-president. Of course I myself have no problems with the dad being the primary caregiver (if that's even the plan) but I wonder how that would go over among the evangelical voters she is supposed to be bringing in.

    Thank you; this is excellent, and will help me make the points clearer to people I talk with.

    Note to JessSpiz: you say, "By the way, most studies say that at least 90% of women who receive a Down syndrome diagnosis in-utero do choose to abort. I would have to assume that the majority of those women are pro-choice because it would go against all reason for a pro-lifer to abort. By the very fact that they choose to abort, they are defined as pro-choice, no?" That makes sense, yes. Unfortunately, there's a substantial amount of literature (anecdotal and research both) indicating that many women who call themselves pro-life will find a justification for needing an abortion for themselves, while continuing to maintain that it should be illegal on principle. (I'm sorry, I don't have the references handy, but googling should turn it up, or maybe one of the other readers here will know.)

    I didn't abort TWO fetuses!! Where's my prize??

    Not about abortion - but about Palin... they just announced on the news that she "makes cookies for the press corps" and she went from "beauty queen to mom of five."

    I don't even know what to say about this - choosing her was to appeal to Hillary supporters, but she could be no more the antithesis of Hillary if she tried.

    I have to say, I am already sick of some bloggers putting down women who are democrats and who find the choice of Palin to be appealing. They go so far as to call them stupid and put down women who want a woman in office so badly that they would vote for McCain. I don't get why that isn't understandable on an at least emotional level.

    I think the truth about her will spread - and people will be turned off by her politics in time. People will get ill at how very conservative she is, and how she embodies the republicans' image of a perfect woman (they just said on the news, "She hunts ... she kills her own food." whatta woman!!!).

    To AF:

    Thanks for the info on pro-life women who justify the abortion. I am sure they do exist. I will look for the research as this is a very interesting topic to me. There has to be a statistic out there about the percentage of people who choose abortion that are pro-choice vs. pro-life.

    By the way I am pro-life but I would NEVER judge a woman who has made that decision. My cousin aborted her baby because he was found to have thalasmia (a blood disorder). My heart broke for her and her son and every time I see her I feel badly. What makes me the saddest is that she doubted her ability to parent a special needs child because so many people (sisters, doctors) told her how hard it would be. I just wish women would have more faith in themselves especialyy when facing an unknown situation.

    You know, I read this and it bugged me, too, for the same reason. I couldn't articulate it as well as you did here, though.

    There were good reasons to want access to safe, legal abortion long before it was possible to diagnose things like Down's syndrome in utero.

    Here in rural Louisiana, well to do pro-lifers just go to Houston when they want abortions. This enables them to continue their important work.

    There were good reasons to want access to safe, legal abortion long before it was possible to diagnose things like Down's syndrome in utero.

    Here in rural Louisiana, well to do pro-lifers just go to Houston when they want abortions. This enables them to continue their important work.

    There were good reasons to want access to safe, legal abortion long before it was possible to diagnose things like Down's syndrome in utero.

    Here in rural Louisiana, well to do pro-lifers just go to Houston when they want abortions. This enables them to continue their important work.

    Sorry, latching on to the numbers here...

    JessSpiz wrote, "most studies say that at least 90% of women who receive a Down syndrome diagnosis in-utero do choose to abort. I would have to assume that the majority of those women are pro-choice because it would go against all reason for a pro-lifer to abort."

    There are only two conclusions that one can draw from those statements:

    Option 1: This means that roughly 90% of women are pro-choice and the pro-life viewpoint is out of touch with the vast majority of women.

    OR:

    Option 2: Pro-choice women are FAR, FAR, FAR more likely than pro-life women to conceive a fetus with Down's Syndrome.

    If one takes away JessSpiz's assumption that most of these women are pro-choice, we also have:

    Option 3: Pro-life women get abortions, too.

    Word.

    I thought the same thing when I read this: I wonder how this child feels being discussed in this manner? And I also wonder: were we capable of screening for gay, would she be even more heroic for going ahead? I don't get it.

    Oh, I just LOVE statistics! So, I'm trying to find this magical 90% number published somewhere other than a pro-life website. And I do hit upon it in a legitimate source, referring to a study that appears to be British, from the early 90s, that says 91% of the women in the study who had undergone amniocentesis to confirm a diagnosis of Down's Syndrome at roughly 17 weeks had chosen to abort the fetus.

    But when we throw around that 90%... it leaves out all the women who had a diagnosis from other means and kept the fetus, had the maybe/maybe not diagnosis from less trustworthy tests and decided not to have further testing... and those, like I did with #3, who simply said, "Why bother? I'd keep him regardless" (though I am staunchly pro-choice). So, while she might stand out in the category of "I know for sure and I'm still keeping him", she hardly stands out among all the parents who said "I'll take my chances."

    Thank you for stating exactly what I was feeling! It's one of the reasons I enjoy reading your posts is that you have an ability to put into words those feelings that many of us have.

    I totally agree with you, NK. I left a comment about this over at The Paper Chase, too. I can imagine that pro-life women would never have an abortion under any circumstances, but I would also imagine that plenty of pro-choice women continue pregnancies when they know the baby has Down Syndrome. I am irritated that that the press are using Palin's actions as proof of her commitment to the cause.

    Thank you for this.

    I'm more than a little bitter about the hypocrisy of painting Palin's choice as the mark of someone extraordinary and simultaneously trying to force any other (perhaps perfectly ordinary) woman to do it, too.

    You know my history, and I happen to think that the choice I made was the best thing I as a mother could do for my daughter. But I would never, never try to make that decision for any other woman.

    I just wanted to comment in response to your question about the statistics of how many mothers abort children with down syndrome. The percentage is around 80%. Eighty percent of women who find out they are carrying a child with Down syndrome will choose an abortion. So, while I don't think it is fair to say that only pro-life women would choose to raise a child with down syndrome, I do think that Paulin should be commended for giving her baby life and for valuing him for the person he is, even though he doesn't fit into the "perfect" mold that many people expect. That type of love definitely crosses party lines and I hope that we'll see more of it. People with specail needs bring so much to the world and can end up really blessing their families. I hate that so many people are missing out on that.

    ~Rachel, mom to 2 special needs kids and adopting one more

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    • Anything posted here represents my personal opinions and does not in any way reflect the opinions or policies of my law school. And this should go without saying, but just to be clear: I am a law student. Nothing here should be taken to remotely constitute anything like legal advice.

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