Mantras

  • I wake to sleep, and take my waking slow.
    I feel my fate in what I cannot fear.
    I learn by going where I have to go.
    --Theodore Roethke
  • Freedom is what you do with what's been done to you.
    -- Jean-Paul Sartre
  • I'm Nobody! Who are you?
    Are you—Nobody—Too?
    Then there's a pair of us!
    Don't tell! they'd advertise—you know!

    How dreary—to be—Somebody!
    How public—like a Frog—
    To tell one's name—the livelong June—
    To an admiring Bog!
    --Emily Dickinson

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    Tuesday, September 11, 2007

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    » I Think They Were Smarter... from The Useless Tree
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    Oh so familiar. I teach a course on women in the ancient and medieval west, and I constantly have to combat the "march of progress" version of the story. I still haven't come up with the perfect response, but one that has gotten me at least partway there is to let the clichés fly for a couple of minutes, then slowly work them around to the fact that they are labling things as better or worse, depending on how much they look like us. Most of them see the narcissism inherent in their assumptions, and at least temporarily bring themselves up short.

    Oh, yes. We talked about this a little when I was teaching Swift's "A Modest Proposal."

    And to be fair, I realize that at times, I struggle with the opposite problem: I catch myself being unwilling to believe that Theorist X would make Mistake Y -- or else, find it hard to process that Critic Z is writing about something very simple that lays the ground for more complex thought later.

    Your students might be right if the Flynn Effect is true. :)

    I think you are right on about this, and I certainly see it a lot of the time from students. Interestingly, in a recent discussion a few students said the opposite -- how smart the ancient Mesopotamians etc. must have been to build a civilization with so little technology!

    Do you think that maybe part of the problem is that students often don't distinguish clearly between knowledge and intelligence? I.e. if medieval people didn't know something that they do (existence of Australia, some particular mathematical theory, whatever) then they must have been "stupid": not stopping to think that we know these things not because we are smarter, but because someone else discovered these things and someone told us. (Also, people often don't think about the millions of things that medieval people knew that your average young adult today has no idea about: just take agriculture, for one example!)

    Maybe there is also an element of people not really believing that much happened for centuries during the middle ages, and then comparing this to the technological changes of the last 50 years, they wonder why medieval people didn't invent modern technologies (not considering the contributions of prior science that laid the foundations for modern tech, and the other prerequisites of modern society necessary to get to this point).

    (Did I just embarrass myself with a big display of ignorance of my own? Feel free to smack me down.)

    This brings me to one of my cherished theories about studying the Middle Ages: that we're not even figuring out what happened then, as much as we are trying to dismantle assumptions about the Middle Ages that the Victorians constructed and then bequeathed to us.

    so true. And also:

    This brings me to one of my cherished theories about studying the [classics]: that we're not even figuring out what happened then, as much as we are trying to dismantle assumptions about the Middle Ages that the Victorians constructed and then bequeathed to us.

    so true, too.

    There's an interesting review in the new ATLANTIC of a book on prayer books from the Middle Ages, and how they can reveal a lot about the social history of the time. It's a new book from Yale U. Press. Thought you might be interested. Peace.

    Part of the problem with the "March of Progress" idea is that it's precisely the reason Western Civ courses were designed in the first place, to comb through the past and pick out the parts that Tell Us Where We Came From. The narcissicism that Notorious describes (and that's a great way to put it) is inherent in the very structure of most college history survey courses. All the more important to challenge it from within!

    I think Styleygeek is right that one issue is the failure to distinguish knowledge and intelligence.

    One approach I've taken to disrupt the "narcissism" Notorious Ph.D. mentions is to focus on concrete activities. If you have a student who has tried spinning, for instance, they have a sense of the complexity of work. If you show how various bureaucracies organized information, without computers, they see intelligence at work. (Domesday Book works well for this.)

    I start world history with Guns, Germs, and Steel, which offers a lot of fodder for extended discussions about our tendency to believe in Progress with a capital P, and how you measure Progress, and the difference between knowledge and intelligence, and the fallacy of thinking it's "the invention of XYZ" that makes the difference. Then I can keep coming back to those notions when discussing later periods. I hope it sticks.

    Yes, I think there's definitely a failure to distinguish between education and intelligence. I kept asking them about this until one student said, "Well, education was limited to the upper class at that time," and I said, "That's right. Are intelligence and education the same thing?" and they all sort of went, "Oh...no."

    Susan, I like the idea of focusing on concrete activies (my husband and I were playing around with this last night, thinking up all the things that medieval people knew how to do that we don't).

    Notorious, I totally get that in women's history classes, too. What was lovely about my women's history class last spring was (among other things) that they came into class saying, "things sucked for women in the Middle Ages, and they still suck for women now!" (We had to nuance the first half of that a bit, but it was a refreshing point of view.)

    P/H, that's exactly why I dislike Western Civ classes so much! (I know that you and everyone else who teaches them doesn't teach them like that any more, but I still dislike them. Not enough not to teach them if someone will pay me for it, though!)

    Dance, I love that element of Guns, Germs, and Steel - when I used to teach World History I kept trying to figure out a way to use that book. (I know there are problems with it, but it explains so many things that most histories never address! For instance, how the heck does someone actually domesticate plants? That kind of thing.) I love the bit where Diamond talks about being out in the (rain forest? jungle? highlands?) of Papua New Guinea with Papua New Guineans, and they ran out of food, so the Papua New Guineans started collecting mushrooms; at which point Diamond got a bit nervous and suggested that eating mushrooms might not be that smart since so many were poisonous, to which they looked at him like he was an idiot and reminded him that if he was there to learn different species of birds from them, he should know that they're plenty smart enough not to eat poisonous mushrooms. At which point he shut up. That cracks me up. ;-)

    (RH, don't show my students that!)

    See: Choir, preaching to the ...

    I have to teach both parts of the World History survey, and one of the first questions I ask is how many students could catch, subdue and slaughter their dinner. That usually gets us past a lot of the problems you talk about. Then we talk about what to do with the rest of the cow. Once they've figured out that they don't know some very basic kinds of things, they seem to appreciate the real accomplishments of the past.

    For what it's worth, I actually miss teaching Western Civ. I made a kind of sense that World doesn't.

    We should merge our classes: I have the opposite problem. I'm currently teaching the introductory formal methods course to new majors, and some polling and discussion on the first day reveals that, in literary studies at least, people in the PAST were smarter than people TODAY. And they wrote better, more worthy, more literary books, and every thing from modern times is just so much moronic rambling.

    Seriously. It's a room full of 22 year old grumpy old men. They also like to rant about corrupt grammar and rigorous standards.

    Sigh. I should mention I teach English. In an English department. Now my comment likely makes more sense.

    mimi, that's so funny, but I can so see that. I mean, Shakespeare was, like, the best writer ever, right? So it must have all been downhill from there! (I wonder how much that's students subscribing to the "if I can't understand it right away it must be really smart" paradigm.)

    I have some students like Mimi's--we were talking about copyright and intellectual property the other day, and I explained that Perotin could easily rewrite Leonin's music, insert his own bits, add extra lines, and no one would care--and my students were horrified!

    So then I explained about intellectual property as a modern idea, and a student said that we valued ownership of ideas because we were "more selfish" than musicians in the Middle Ages.

    No, just different, I tried to explain.

    Not sure it sank in, though...

    What a great post, NK. Thanks.

    "Just different" is a cop-out though. I don't mean to say that using ethical judgements like `more selfish' is any better, quite the reverse, but surely as historians what we're aiming to do is describe that difference and account for it, if only so as to be able better to understand what our sources are saying!

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